Couch's Arm Strength a Concern

[BF4MVP]

Packers | Couch's Arm Strength a Concern - from www.KFFL.com
Thu, 19 Aug 2004 04:23:02 -0700

Tom Silverstein, of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel, reports <A href="http://www.kffl.com/team/17/nfl">Green Bay Packers QB Tim Couch (http://www.kffl.com/player/461/nfl) (arm) has also created concerns about his arm strength in addition to concerns about whether or not he can handle the team's West Coast offense. Thus far, Couch has shown a surprising lack of strength in his arm. After averaging 60 to 75 throws a day in the first two weeks of training camp, he needed to sit out four practices to let his arm rest. Head coach Mike Sherman (http://www.kffl.com/player/1966/nfl) said the team will continue to push him to improve.

[Les Miles' Hat]

I wonder if this has anything to do with the Browns not allowing Couch to attend team facilities and mini camps...

[BF4MVP]

I wonder if this has anything to do with the Browns not allowing Couch to attend team facilities and mini camps...
definitely possible.... he sure did look like a man who was out of shape, tired, and didnt know the offense on monday

[Les Miles' Hat]

Yeah, I can understand not knowing the offense, but I think that also could be why he looked weak. Anytime you're involved with something new, you're going to kinda question yourself about things, so maybe he wasn't sure where he was supposed to be throwing or something. I don't know. I just hope he gets it worked out soon. I would like to see him succeed.

[BF4MVP]

Yeah, I can understand not knowing the offense, but I think that also could be why he looked weak. Anytime you're involved with something new, you're going to kinda question yourself about things, so maybe he wasn't sure where he was supposed to be throwing or something. I don't know. I just hope he gets it worked out soon. I would like to see him succeed.
i would like to see him succeed as well.... however if reality it may not matter too much because brett will be running the helm all year long barring any injuries
(:eek: the "I" word!!)

[Les Miles' Hat]

i would like to see him succeed as well.... however if reality it may not matter too much because brett will be running the helm all year long barring any injuries
(:eek: the "I" word!!)



OK, let me rephrase that...I'd like to see him succeed in camp, and then do nothing else for the rest of the year. I feel more comfortable if one of the younger QBs could step up. Dougie's been good, but he's only going to last so long. We need a good backup that can hang around for another year or two and develop.

[BF4MVP]

i just dont wanna see this be joe johnson all over again.... lets face it, (knock on wood) we have brett, you could cut bretts left arm off and he'd wobble back into the huddle on the next play.... im not seeing why we're gonna pay a veterans salary to a QB whos already lost 5 years of his career, wont see the field for 3 or 4 possibly when we could draft a middle round QB and have him turn out just as good for less pay.

[BF4MVP]

and then have timmy be a bust, and do absolutely nothing, i think we're better off drafting a QB, and bringing him up in the system.

[Les Miles' Hat]

and then have timmy be a bust, and do absolutely nothing, i think we're better off drafting a QB, and bringing him up in the system.



Like what we tried with Nall?? It's been done and Nall has shown potential but been injured and inconsistent. Couch has real game experience. Just needs to learn the offense. We don't need a superstar to win, just a manager. With the RBs we've got, you just need the threat of passing, not necessarily a good passing game.

And I think it's an overexaggeration to say he's a JJ bust. Couch didn't get a huge signing bonus or a 6 year deal. He's worth a shot for the money we're paying. If he gets cut, we get back the 1.25 mil or whatever, but lose a bit because of the signing bonus. If he makes the team, it's because he's shown something to the coaches. Either way, I don't think it's a big deal.

[BF4MVP]

And I think it's an overexaggeration to say he's a JJ bust. Couch didn't get a huge signing bonus or a 6 year deal. He's worth a shot for the money we're paying. If he gets cut, we get back the 1.25 mil or whatever, but lose a bit because of the signing bonus. If he makes the team, it's because he's shown something to the coaches. Either way, I don't think it's a big deal.
Since its a one year deal, if he stays this year as a backup and we decide hes not the QB we want, is there any cap hit at all after the contract is up?

[Les Miles' Hat]

Since its a one year deal, if he stays this year as a backup and we decide hes not the QB we want, is there any cap hit at all after the contract is up?




Well, if the contract is up, how would we owe him any money?

[BF4MVP]

that entire thing was worded wrong..... and now i dont even know what i was trying to ask lol

[gbpman]

I think unless Couch really turns it up in this next game he will go on the bubble of making this team. The Packers wont keep a 1.25 million backup who has a weak arm and who makes poor decisions. But ya never know Couch had a weak arm and made bad decisions before he signed here.

[BF4MVP]

it wasnt the fact that couch didnt know the offense that bugged me. It was the fact that he didnt show any team spirit, leadership, toughness qualities. He came out of the game, put on his hat and sat on the bench. No eagerness to get better. Just moping around. I dont see the leadership or the toughness needed to lead a team in the NFL. Of course i am used to brett.....

[Whiskey]

I wonder if this has anything to do with the Browns not allowing Couch to attend team facilities and mini camps...

If you're looking to score a contract from a team, and you aren't practicing or going to camps, you'd think that player would take it upon himself to stay in shape, wouldn't you?

Couch is out of shape, no one can even argue that, and it's possible that he's out of shape because Cleveland was not letting him use their facilities.

Couch planned on playing this year, or at least being a backup, yet took no initiative on his own to stay in relatively decent shape apparently.

"I wanna check, but I don't wanna work for it" is how that comes across to me.......but I could be way off base here.

IF that's the case, I truly hope this guy doesn't make the team.

[BF4MVP]

keep in mind even if hes being a complete a-hole, mike mckenzie is continuously working out at his home in memphis, for which i give him credit for

[Whiskey]

Not that Pedersen or Nall are the answers (they're not), but Couch just doesn't blow me away at all.

Also, I'd rather see us draft a guy and develop. Don't point at Craig Nall and say "we tried that already", because he was a VERY RAW 6th round pick who never *really* projected to be NFL starting qb material. I think more than anything, they were hoping to get lucky with a late round pick.

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

Rumor has it Mike is hurt thats why he is working to get back into shape. He should just show up an play. He is suck a loser. I wouldn't cry if i made a few million for playing a GAME. A GAME MIKE. Some ppl work their ass off and get a few thousand.

[BF4MVP]

Rumor has it Mike is hurt thats why he is working to get back into shape. He should just show up an play. He is suck a loser. I wouldn't cry if i made a few million for playing a GAME. A GAME MIKE. Some ppl work their ass off and get a few thousand.
i hear the same.... "the big unit" bill michaels i assume? All i care is that hes in shape and in a packers uniform come spetember 13th. I think he'll fold and be forced to come play once the weekly paychecks start disappearing. Holdouts arent a new thing in the NFL, obviously, and more times than not they end with the player returning to his team.

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

Yep, it was the Unit. It depends how stubborn he wants to be. Mike might be set for life unless he pulls a Tyson. But I will garentee you he will not sit out the remaining 3 years of his contract i believe it is. He would be stupid to do that.

[gbpman]

What I see MM doing is being a little bit*h and holding out till right before you have to report if you want to get a whole year counted against your contract.

[BF4MVP]

honestly, i dont give a damn as long as hes playing and playing well for us this season, but thats just my opinion

[gbpman]

who gave me a bad rep and why?

[BF4MVP]

no idea gbp, check your "user CP" at the upper left of your screen, itll tell the last rep points youve been given/taken

[gbpman]

I think if he misses too much time he might have to be a backup for a bit if he looks rusty or has trouble with the new system.

[gbpman]

sully did cause of my vikes going west post. Well its true AZ buyers are looking into buying them. I willing to bet they would proably want to move them to a market like LA

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

He might be rusty but i think if he is working out, he should be ready to start when he comes back. He knows the system so its not like he has to learn it. A week of practice should get him back in the right position.

[BF4MVP]

He might be rusty but i think if he is working out, he should be ready to start when he comes back. He knows the system so its not like he has to learn it. A week of practice should get him back in the right position.
he doesnt know the system, bob slowik completely overhauled the defense with the emphasis on 15-20% more blitzing, thes plays that we used last year wont be used nearly as much, with new blitzes and formations added during training camp.

[gbpman]

all I know is if I am going to be made to look like a bad poster when I am not I do not know how long I will continue to post here.

[Les Miles' Hat]

all I know is if I am going to be made to look like a bad poster when I am not I do not know how long I will continue to post here.



I don't think it was the idea of the post, but the commentary at the end about MN fans becoming bandwagon fans. If someone said that about packer fans, would you like it?? Would you give them a bad rep point?? It's just a number, and really how many times do you look at rep points before you read a post?? They're not that big of a deal. Just keep posting, and your numbers will go up.

[BF4MVP]

i wouldnt worry about it gbp.... its still early, and i know you as a good poster so as the board progresses you will build up good reputation to the point that one or 2 negatives wont hurt you. Think of it as a baseball batting average, early in the season, a few Ks will put you at a .196 BA and you look like a bad hitter, but if your hitting .335 late in the season with a ton of ABs, a few Ks wont drop you down that much.

[BF4MVP]

on a separate note, we need more posters on this board so i can give rep points where they are due.... i keep trying to give positive rep points but it tells me i must spread it around (which is understandable). The problem lies in the fact that these are the only people i talk to on these boards so i have no one else to give rep points to. Here and the brewers board at least.

[gbpman]

well I posted it on the Packers board only not on the vikings board. I dont go there I have no need or right to be on there board so I dont. But yeah people see that I am a unpleaset poster that relfects bad to me. I did it in fun and i did not post it on the vikings board to try to cause any trouble so I dont see the big deal in it.

[BangOnMeDrumAllDay]

I seem to remember people like Kerry Collins, Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer being considered busts then all of a sudden they are SB QB's. With a solid running game and offensive line and some key additions to the defense in the coming years, Couch could be a serviceable replacement. Hell, look at Denver and the high expectations they had trying to replace Elway. And you never know when you will find the next Steve Young.

I dont believe that Couch will be Steve Young caliber player, but those other bozos yes.

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

he doesnt know the system, bob slowik completely overhauled the defense with the emphasis on 15-20% more blitzing, thes plays that we used last year wont be used nearly as much, with new blitzes and formations added during training camp.
I forgot they got a new D cordinator. Yall can just screw that post of mine.

[gbpman]

thing is with those QB those QBs did stink and they are not good starters. they had very very good Ds which carried the team. The QBs where asked to not win the game just not lose it.

[BF4MVP]

lmao i must give props to BAMDAD's avatar, that is kickass dude!

[gbpman]

to make everyone happy I delted the message.

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

to make everyone happy I delted the message.
Man you are really worried about that one post.

[Les Miles' Hat]

Don't worry, gbpman. All it says is you're a "slightly" unpleasant poster. That's no big deal. We all already knew that from the ESPN board... ;)

[gbpman]

I admit I dont like being bashed for stuff. I am a good poster who talks football. but ya got to have some fun. Would I care if the vikings posters bash the pack on there board? No cause I dont go there and it would proably just be trouble if I did. As long as there is no bad stuff like wishing death or bodily harm on someone I dont see any harm.

[Whiskey]

The problem I'm percieving with Couch is not a lack of arm strength, hell, everyone already KNEW that, right?

It's coming in out of shape, lethargic, and (according to what people saw on Monday) very disspirited, and not part of the team.

I can deal with a QB with a weak arm, or a guy who was a "bust" before, but I don't think Couch can even be mentioned in the same breath as a guy like Collins, Brad Johnson, or Trent Dilfer until he PROVES that he's in camp for more than just a paycheck.

[gbpman]

well look Couch cried about the fans in Clev. when they turned on him. What do you expect if your not producing and bascilly stinking of course they will turn on you esp when your a first overall high paid player.

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

I don't wanna sound like a person who just killed the party but i was thinking. Who cares who the backups are. When has Favre sat? He broke his thumb and still played. You would have to kill him to get him outta a game.

[Les Miles' Hat]

I don't wanna sound like a person who just killed the party but i was thinking. Who cares who the backups are. When has Favre sat? He broke his thumb and still played. You would have to kill him to get him outta a game.




Brock Lesnar doesn't wear a towel with jersey numbers on it, does he??

[gbpman]

cause ya want a good backup. No one ever thinks or wants to have there backup play but you want a good one just in case.

[Les Miles' Hat]

Is it possible the only reason the "arm strength" issue comes up is because we've been watching Favre launch missles for 12 years now??

[gbpman]

well as an article on JSonline brought up this style of the WCO was built for just Brett Favre or another strong armed QB. There are lots of players where the QB has to roll out of the pocket and through. Brett can do it cause of the arm strength. Couch does not have that or the accurceny to run this offense IMO.

[Les Miles' Hat]

well as an article on JSonline brought up this style of the WCO was built for just Brett Favre or another strong armed QB. There are lots of players where the QB has to roll out of the pocket and through. Brett can do it cause of the arm strength. Couch does not have that or the accurceny to run this offense IMO.


I don't recall Montana being particularly strong armed...and Couch played in just one game. I just have a hard time believing anyone could have drawn a conclusion that he can't run the system just seeing him in 2 quarters of his first game.

[gbpman]

I am just thinking if they dont redo it when favre retires and wanted couch to be there man they would have to restyle the offense to his style of play.

[BF4MVP]

im thinking of how perfect JP Losman would be right now.....

[Les Miles' Hat]

im thinking of how perfect JP Losman would be right now.....




and the hindsight begins...


There's no guarantee he would've picked up the offense any better than Couch has in 2 weeks. If Losman was picked, we'd all be sitting here saying "Why did we draft a QB when it's obvious that Hawthorne can't cover! Carroll and Gamble were both available!!"

[BF4MVP]

actually it was just a silly thought..... on draft day i was completely happy with our decision to take a DB over a QB, and i still am, i would have liked gamble but i think carroll will turn out alright too

[LetsGoBrewCrew]

Pack shoulda traded up to get Losman. He will be good in his prime.

[gbpman]

I think Losman has to become a little bit more humble. IMO he is a little to full of himself.

[BF4MVP]

well lookie here, back to even on the rep gbp, good work

[BangOnMeDrumAllDay]

yeah in his prime. that will be when he will be a free agent. Bledsoe is the man in Buffalo.

[gbpman]

bledsoe IMO has this year plus one more there before they get rid of him for JP