National League East Chat Archive

[manny]

Magic Number to eliminate the phillies from the Eastern Division Race

1

[PhilaVa]

It took you that long to already make a comment like that..? Thanks.

[manny]

sorry, just had to do it

[manny]

Honestly, I saw that it had no posts, so I went ahead and posted the first. I used to be one that posted fairly regularly on the ESPN Phillies board.

[PhilaVa]

Yeah I am usually over on that board too, what name do you post under since you seem to be a Braves fan..LoL..:mad:

[manny]

you're looking at it, I haven't been over there in years though.

[PhilaVa]

Walks Five in the first Inning, the Phillies score only two runs. If that doesn't just sum up our season in one inning I don't know what would. Add on to that the runs were scored on a double play and a wild pitch and this is almost embarrassing. Really..

[manny]

ouch, sounds like our April and May. Nothing went right.

[PhilaVa]

Yeah, I don't remember you, I doubt I was around at that time. What made you stop posting there and what made you come here to post...?


What is the Braves board like, you have a bunch of posters?

[manny]

I went to sports-boards.com when espn started the validation thing. Then I moved over here after sb.com crashed and I found out about it. We don't have as many on .net as we had on .com. We are all over the place now.

[PhilaVa]

I guess the only good news that comes out of that first inning is that Beckett threw 42 pitches in that inning.

That was a bad call, Pierre was thrown out. That's awful.

[PhilaVa]

Oh, give me a little bit of history on this, I don't know much. What all happened?

And how involved are you in it?

[manny]

I was just the biggest motor mouth on each of them. The owner of sb.com ran out of money.

[PhilaVa]

So who owns .net? Are they going to be running out of money.

How about any problems, does it look like there are many problems with the new boards?

[manny]

sully and ryr own this one, I don't think they will run out of money. Very few bugs around here.

[PhilaVa]

How about as far as crashing...

And Popularity...you think it will continue to grow anywhere close to the number of posters on ESPN?

[manny]

it goes down when hurricanes hit the server, (Orlando)

the site is growing quickly as the sb.com people find it and more from espn come over.

[PhilaVa]

thats funny, it goes down when hurricane hits...

what about if it gets a bunch of users...? Can it handle it?

[manny]

haven't had any issues yet.

[PhilaVa]

I said, what do you think, will that be an issue later? If the site continues to grow. At some point the owners will be able to start getting advertisments you would think.

The board is nice I must say. I'm going to get some food now, be back later.

[manny]

I think they will be able to get advertisements the same as eggs did with .com.

I expect the forum to work smoothly.

[PhilaVa]

I like it so far, so nothing to complain about...


what is up with thses rep points, do I need them? Can you give me some? LoL...?

[manny]

troll control of sorts, I can, and did give you 6 points. You have the ability to give 1 at this point.

[sully]

There is an article regarding reputation points, and if you'd like, I'll copy the post here that The Slob made that's a pretty good explanation of reputation points.

[sully]

thats funny, it goes down when hurricane hits...

what about if it gets a bunch of users...? Can it handle it?
We've had over 100 users at a time on before. Our current high is 179, and we normally have 20-40 on at a time. We shouldn't have a problem handling mass quantities of users.

[sully]

I went to sports-boards.com when espn started the validation thing. Then I moved over here after sb.com crashed and I found out about it. We don't have as many on .net as we had on .com. We are all over the place now.
Actually, manny, ryr and vikaves have both told me that we get more users on here (As far as activity) than S-B.com ever had, and it's not even close.

[ryr8828]

We started out with an inexpensive package, then upgraded it greatly when the demand required it. It should be enough for quite some time.
I hope it isn't though, I really wish for us to have to upgrade again. We're in it for the long haul. That was the idea behind the partnership.

[manny]

Actually, manny, ryr and vikaves have both told me that we get more users on here (As far as activity) than S-B.com ever had, and it's not even close.
my bad, I was going by total number registered all time I suppose.

[ryr8828]

Actually, manny, ryr and vikaves have both told me that we get more users on here (As far as activity) than S-B.com ever had, and it's not even close.
I think manny meant Braves fans. They've been hard to contact, for one thing.

Another thing that's really strange, and I've noticed it on the Cards board (even though the Cards board has lots of posts) is that posts are down when both teams are winning. No one in the media expected the Cards to win the division yet they have the best record in baseball. Most thought the Braves had worn out their welcome at the front yet they're right up there again.

It seems sometimes that people post more when they have something to bitch about.:)

[sully]

As far as cumulative membership, .com takes the bag easily since there were thousands of members there.

However, .com usually only had 10-12 users online at a time. As I'm sure you've noticed, this place right now regularly has 30-40 folks online at a time, and that number has gone as high as 179.

[sully]

I think manny meant Braves fans. They've been hard to contact, for one thing.

Another thing that's really strange, and I've noticed it on the Cards board (even though the Cards board has lots of posts) is that posts are down when both teams are winning. No one in the media expected the Cards to win the division yet they have the best record in baseball. Most thought the Braves had worn out their welcome at the front yet they're right up there again.

It seems sometimes that people post more when they have something to bitch about.:)
The football boards are doing great. Hopefully some of those folks will find their way to the baseball side of the site.

[manny]

I think manny meant Braves fans. They've been hard to contact, for one thing.

Another thing that's really strange, and I've noticed it on the Cards board (even though the Cards board has lots of posts) is that posts are down when both teams are winning. No one in the media expected the Cards to win the division yet they have the best record in baseball. Most thought the Braves had worn out their welcome at the front yet they're right up there again.

It seems sometimes that people post more when they have something to bitch about.:)
it sure seems that way.

[manny]

As far as cumulative membership, .com takes the bag easily since there were thousands of members there.

However, .com usually only had 10-12 users online at a time. As I'm sure you've noticed, this place right now regularly has 30-40 folks online at a time, and that number has gone as high as 179.
I have noticed, I guess that's why I am spending more time over here than when I first started.

[PhilaVa]

Sounds good all, I'm glad to be apart of it in some manner. I like what I see so far and thanks for all the explainations today, they were very helpful.

[Domino427]

this place is awesome. So glad I found it. I havent posted at ESPN for so long. How bad has it been Phila?

[PhilaVa]

Things aren't bad, except on the Eagles board, the Phils board is slow even on ESPN, b/c of their poor play. But the Eagles board is just out of control and I had enough..

[PhilaVa]

Tell you what, that really feels good, knocking them officially out of the playoff race, I really hate those shmucks...all of them.

[MadNova]

Why I oughtta.....And to think I gave you rep points today..

[PhilaVa]

Hey, I just got done with the ugly girl, I want some more Rep points, YOU PROMISED.

JRoll...where you at?

[MadNova]

I already rep-ed you once.

Now I have to spread rep around before you get it again.

And if I do that, I'll be past my rep quota for the day, and will have to wait until tomorrow.

[MadNova]

By then my rep might be worth 16 at a shot.

[JRoll]

im here, im not frequenting this board much right now, not much goin on, the Eagles and Lions board is more interesting

[manny]

Tell you what, that really feels good, knocking them officially out of the playoff race, I really hate those shmucks...all of them.
technically they aren't eliminated yet, and neither are the Phillies. The Braves have a magic number of one against each of them. Then there's the wild card as well.

[manny]

Hey, I just got done with the ugly girl, I want some more Rep points, YOU PROMISED.

JRoll...where you at?
you can give rep as well, just not to yourself.

[manny]

tisk tisk tisk, trying to make me regret that boost of rep points last night are ya?

[PhilaVa]

Hey, no one forced you to do anything...

I used protection, I don't know why you are so upset.

[manny]

The Phils did their part last night, my Braves however didn't. Now we will just have to beat the Marlins to have them watch the celebration first hand.

[JRoll]

i saw JRoll's homerun last night and i asked myself "where did all his power come from this year?" I never expected him to hit 12 HR's coming into this season but i expected his overall stats. He's just turning the corner now and becoming a better player. The scary thing is, I dont think he's at his best yet.

[PhilaVa]

The Phils did their part last night, my Braves however didn't. Now we will just have to beat the Marlins to have them watch the celebration first hand.
Hey, I got your celebration right here..bro..

[PhilaVa]

i saw JRoll's homerun last night and i asked myself "where did all his power come from this year?" I never expected him to hit 12 HR's coming into this season but i expected his overall stats. He's just turning the corner now and becoming a better player. The scary thing is, I dont think he's at his best yet.
I totally agree, I love the guy. I like to see the HRs but they kinda worry me...although this year he seemed to keep his head in the game plan more often then not and the HRs were more line drives.

that was a sweet HR last night though...

[JRoll]

before this year, he hit HR's and then for about 10 games afterwards he would try to hit HR's every AB. This year, he hits a HR but he doesnt change his style of play, which makes a big difference. I think that's one of the reasons for his average being as high as it is this year. I think another reason for his average is he's been working on his swing and it's finally paying off. I feel that he can be a solid .270-.280 hitter with 7-10 HR's and 60-70 RBI's per season and with his defense, he is going to be a great player for us. The combination of him and Utley could be lethal for other teams.

[manny]

that disease is currently called Fookyitis for Furcal. A few years ago he hit a homer on opening day and I knew he was screwed.

[JRoll]

I remember all the debates we had on the ESPN boards about Rollins vs. Furcal, lol. Phila remembers those I'm sure.

[PhilaVa]

Yes, I'm absolutly sure that the Braves fans have no arguement right now.


Rollins is clearly put himself out in front of Furcal. I'm sure some boneheads over at ESPN would still disagree, but what do they know.

[manny]

Fooky has to get on base more to be effective, and then run more when he's out there to screw with the pitcher like Otis Nixon used to do for us.

[PhilaVa]

Fooky has to get on base more to be effective, and then run more when he's out there to screw with the pitcher like Otis Nixon used to do for us.
It would hurt either if he would learn how to field like a Major League SS, or at the very least close to it.

[manny]

It would hurt either if he would learn how to field like a Major League SS, or at the very least close to it.
The fielding isn't so much the problem as throwing it when he shouldn't. He's abusing that cannon of an arm.

[PhilaVa]

The fielding isn't so much the problem as throwing it when he shouldn't. He's abusing that cannon of an arm.
Say what?!? He has a great arm, but he doesn't know where it is going, even when he has time. And his fielding of the ball is the worst part.

[manny]

he rushes himself, and thus makes some stupid throws. He needs to work with Pac-Man more while he is up with the big club.

[PhilaVa]

he rushes himself, and thus makes some stupid throws. He needs to work with Pac-Man more while he is up with the big club.
Sorry, but in comparison with all other SS, he is way off the pace. That's why I consider Rollins > Fucal

[manny]

that's fine, I don't see Rollins play as much as I see the Fookster.

[PhilaVa]

that's fine, I don't see Rollins play as much as I see the Fookster.
Well, why do you call him that?

[manny]

Fooky and Furky are just some of the nicknames he has acquired. Bobby calls him Furky I think.

[PhilaVa]

Well, at least he is close, I hear that Jack McKeon can't even remember his players names...LoL..

[PhilaVa]

Congrats to the Braves for winning the division for the 10th straight year...damnit.

[manny]

what a playoff push for the Marlins, get swept by the Phillies and follow that up by a sweep at the hands of the Braves.

[manny]

there's always next year where the media will predict that 2005 will be the end of the Braves run, just like they do every year now.

[PhilaVa]

Yes, I enjoyed their downfall this year expecially after last year. Looks like the Phils may finish second this year, so pathetic....so very very pathetic.

[manny]

barring a complete reversal of fortunes, yes the Phils will finish in 2nd.

[PhilaVa]

No, after this year, after what they pulled off this year I highly doubt that anyone will pick against them.

I can understand why they did it the past two years with the names the braves lost but after the performance of this year I don't think they will be not picked to win again.

Depending on what they do with their contracts...but even then they will still be the favorites.

[PhilaVa]

Well, I say maybe due to the fact that I know my team, and how they like to play vs. the Marlins. Now that the Playoffs are completely out of play then maybe they'll choke up 2nd place on the last weekend...like it matters.

[manny]

what's the spread between the two teams now?

[PhilaVa]

The Phils are two games up on them. It would also be nice if they would finish within single digits of the braves...I mean seriously...how horrible is my team.

[manny]

Even the Atlanta media has been saying this is the year that will break the streak since '98

[manny]

the Marlins are in free fall and shouldn't make much of a push the rest of the way, finishing within 10 games may be a difficult task with the Braves trying to secure 2nd in the league though.

[PhilaVa]

Even the Atlanta media has been saying this is the year that will break the streak since '98
Yeah, but if you don't realize why they were saying it then you are way over the top Homer. You would have to believe in the coaching staff big time to get that pitching staff to perform like they did, it really was magic what they did with the pitching staff this year. Amazing..

[PhilaVa]

Up 2.5 on the dodgers I doubt that is really a problem, but I am excited about watching the games this weekend and seeing what happens, expecially with the Cubs and Braves playing this weekend.

I love playoff baseball, too bad my team hasn't been there in over a decade but I still get excited over it.

[manny]

They need to send a message to the Cubs, so that if the Cubs make the playoffs, it will be only because the Giants are losing, since the Cubs would be playing Atlanta in the first round.

[manny]

the radio stations have started keeping Terrance Moore's articles and seeing exactly how close they are to the year before. This year I could understand, and even the year before, but for some of them, it was retarded to pick against them.

[PhilaVa]

I actually think the Braves have a good opprotunity this year...if the Cubs make it I think they are the favorites even though they are playing like they don't want it right now.

But everyone else has issues, even the Cards. As much as I don't like to say it this may be a good opprotunity for them to go the WS...

[PhilaVa]

I really don't think it was that out of hand, considering the players they lost, sheff, maddux, lopez...but after this year until they are beaten no 'expert' should pick against them unless they lose it or change managers..

[manny]

I was even thinking the last two years could be the one that ended it. Especially this year. Wright stepped up big time. Estrada was huge, and JD Drew was outstanding.

[manny]

this team has been as surprising as the 1991 team. Chipper will have to play to the end to get the 100 RBIs to tie Sosa's RBI record. The DL stint hurt him this spring.

[PhilaVa]

Yes, those are three things no one expected and I still hate JD Drew...I actually hope he fails.


Estrada kinda faded off, not a very impressive end to the season for him, what is his BA right now?

[PhilaVa]

Yeah, couldn't believe how bad he was playin earlier this year, you never think about how injuried this players are if they are still in the game every day.


Alright, I'm going to go catch some lunch, chat later.

[manny]

aight, check ya later

[manny]

.313, he took a beating behind the plate this year from foul balls.

[PhilaVa]

Yeah, I will be interested to see if he can do what he did this year again, for a whole year and even at all. Cox seems to give him a ton of days off, more then any other catchers in the league.

[manny]

4 on, one off for the most part, same as he did with Javy last year.

[PhilaVa]

I dunno, just seemed like every time I turned around he was sitting out. So it looks like the Braves will be playing the NL West winner no matter what so who would you rather want the Dodgers or Giants?

[manny]

if the Cubs win the Wild Card we play them. I would rather the Giants win the card and us play the Dodgers.

[PhilaVa]

Ah you're correct, forgot about the divisional rule, I would really like to see a Cubs / Red Sox world series, and then I wouldn't care who would win. I could sit down and enjoy a game everynight with those two teams in those two stadiums. Actually I want the Red Sox to win, I'm still a huge Schilling fan ever since he left.

[manny]

that would be a World Series that would end in a tie, Selig would find a way.

[PhilaVa]

Oh Lord, Selig is such a joke, I can't believe they extended this bafoons' contract...end the madness...


Who are the three starters for the playoffs for Atl?

[JRoll]

They scooped up who I was hoping the Phillies could get.

Omar Minaya. I think he wouldve been a good GM for this team. He had his hands tied in Montreal and still didnt do too bad.

[PhilaVa]

They scooped up who I was hoping the Phillies could get.

Omar Minaya. I think he wouldve been a good GM for this team. He had his hands tied in Montreal and still didnt do too bad.
Ed Wade isn't going anywhere, did you hear?

The question is, will they finally trash Bow?

[JRoll]

I know Wade isnt going anywhere, but I could wish couldnt I? Thanks for ruining my wish...Jerk ;)

[PhilaVa]

I know Wade isnt going anywhere, but I could wish couldnt I? Thanks for ruining my wish...Jerk ;)
Well, I'm just saying we knew Wade wasn't going anywhere, and we knew that the Mets needed a change after the moron moves they made this year. I cannot believe the stupid moves the Mets made this season, makes Ed Wade look like John Shurholtzs.

[JRoll]

The funny thing is Minaya isnt GM, he's a step above, I think his official title is Head of Baseball Operations.

[PhilaVa]

The funny thing is Minaya isnt GM, he's a step above, I think his official title is Head of Baseball Operations.
They needed it, seriously, perhaps one of the biggest crap seasons on the field and in the front office ever...so they needed this from a business and PR move. Shea was close to being burnt down...

[thomeismyhomie]

So what did you guys think of sweeping the Fish? That was a sweet sweet moment in a sad year. JRoll, I have been in need of your assistance cause noone else wants to admit that we have a shot at Zito. Duck wants Pedro. What the hell is that? Do you think he's crazy as well? Do you guys want Milton back? How about CF?

[JRoll]

In one of the threads on this board, I toyed with the fact of not re-signing Wagner, Millwood, and Milton and throwing a shitload of money at Pedro but decided that we could have good young pitching for less money. I wish Zito would come to Philly but I think he's a FA next offseason so the only way would be in a trade. I don't think Milton should be back, we could have Lidle for less if we would need him. Right now, Pavano or Clement are my 2 choices.

[thomeismyhomie]

I think we bring Lidle back, no doubt about it. He pitched well and we gave up solid prospects. We need him to be on the team. I think we could get Zito if we offered them Howard. Seriously, just that. Oakland penny pinches and they dont even want Zito anymore. They are so hard up on Rich Harden, for good reason I guess. I still stick by Clement cause I think Povano will be overpriced, and in pinstripes. I want Milton around simply out of loyalty. He gutted out this year when most of our pitchers folded and he even got us some wins. I think with some of that pressure off of him, he could be much better next year.

[PhilaVa]

I think we bring Lidle back, no doubt about it. He pitched well and we gave up solid prospects. We need him to be on the team. I think we could get Zito if we offered them Howard. Seriously, just that. Oakland penny pinches and they dont even want Zito anymore. They are so hard up on Rich Harden, for good reason I guess. I still stick by Clement cause I think Povano will be overpriced, and in pinstripes. I want Milton around simply out of loyalty. He gutted out this year when most of our pitchers folded and he even got us some wins. I think with some of that pressure off of him, he could be much better next year.

- Oakland wants Harden instead of Zito b/c they feel like Power pitching rules in the playoffs, and they are on the correct track but it doesn't always come true.

I like what Duck has to say, but I doubt Pedro will NOT be a Red Sox next year.

[thomeismyhomie]

Must be nice to not worry about losing a Cy-Young winner huh? Man, if they ever put some effort in to that offense, they would be scary.

[PhilaVa]

Must be nice to not worry about losing a Cy-Young winner huh? Man, if they ever put some effort in to that offense, they would be scary.

They just don't have the money...that's the problem with baseball, a class organization like the A's cannot keep it's players, baseball is crap.

[thomeismyhomie]

there has to be a happy medium between the crap that MLB is, and the crap that the NFL has become with the cap and FA. I have felt it as much as anyone year by year watching Montana, Rice, Young, Lott, Craig, Hearst, Garcia etc. being forced out. Thats not right either.

[PhilaVa]

there has to be a happy medium between the crap that MLB is, and the crap that the NFL has become with the cap and FA. I have felt it as much as anyone year by year watching Montana, Rice, Young, Lott, Craig, Hearst, Garcia etc. being forced out. Thats not right either.

I really don't understand how you can think that the NFL is crap? It's 100% better then baseball and Footbal is a lot different since those players were together in the NFL, you can do what you want through FA in Football too.

Just look at which league is trying to keep it's head above water in popularity and which on is walking on water.

[thomeismyhomie]

I may be biased in my NFL opinion, I admit. It would be like a Yankee fan having to deal with them becoming mediocre cause they arent allowed to spend money anymore. I do agree with you that it is much better than baseball.

[PhilaVa]

I may be biased in my NFL opinion, I admit. It would be like a Yankee fan having to deal with them becoming mediocre cause they arent allowed to spend money anymore. I do agree with you that it is much better than baseball.

All you have to know about football is just looking at the Philadelphia Eagles, if you do things correctly you can be good for a long time.

Talk about, the Eagles have the best record in the league since 2000 and are still second best in the league in being under the cap, it's call intelligence, it would be nice if the Phils would get some...

[JRoll]

so Joe Banner or Andy Reid for Phils GM?

[thomeismyhomie]

Sure they have intelligence, but I still say it was stupid to sign Kearse for all that cash. Why mess up a good thing they had going?

[JRoll]

Sure they have intelligence, but I still say it was stupid to sign Kearse for all that cash. Why mess up a good thing they had going?
The impact he had in the last game was amazing, if he can do half of that the rest of the season, he was well worth the money

[PhilaVa]

so Joe Banner or Andy Reid for Phils GM?


How about we just clone them both..?

Sure they have intelligence, but I still say it was stupid to sign Kearse for all that cash. Why mess up a good thing they had going?

Aparently you don't want many Eagles games..he has already had an impact...we needed a pash rusher, it was a great move.

[JRoll]

How about we just clone them both..?
Andy can be the manager and Banner can be the GM. Brilliant!

[thomeismyhomie]

I'm not saying he isnt an impact. The guy is a FREAK as advertised. But come on, you know that you hold your breath every time you see him out there. Seriously, I am not hating on the Eagles but for a team who seems to make calculated moves, getting him was a big risk. Sure, if he stays healthy they look genius, but theres probably a better chance of him getting hurt.

[PhilaVa]

I'm not saying he isnt an impact. The guy is a FREAK as advertised. But come on, you know that you hold your breath every time you see him out there. Seriously, I am not hating on the Eagles but for a team who seems to make calculated moves, getting him was a big risk. Sure, if he stays healthy they look genius, but theres probably a better chance of him getting hurt.

Any player can get hurt...people are over the top with Jevon, sure he has had injuries, but does that mean he is going to go down again, maybe...maybe not.

It's not a reason to shy away from him, as you can see he is doing fine.

Andy moved up in the draft to pick shawn andrews, he is now out for the year, does it make the move any less great? Not really it's just unfortunate.

[thomeismyhomie]

You're just being difficult now Phila. You know what I am talking about. I hope he does stay healthy cause he needs to get his career back on track. He definitely has the tools to be great.

[thomeismyhomie]

We're going to se a great matchup tonight guys. Something tells me we may be seeing these guys go at it for a LONG time.

[PhilaVa]

We're going to se a great matchup tonight guys. Something tells me we may be seeing these guys go at it for a LONG time.

It would be nice to beat Dontrelle again like last week and make sure we finish second this year, it's the only thing to play for at this point...

[thomeismyhomie]

It would definitely be a token to take say 6 of 7 from Florida the last week or so of the season. Too bad it's too late, we all knew we were capable of this type of stuff.

[PhilaVa]

It would definitely be a token to take say 6 of 7 from Florida the last week or so of the season. Too bad it's too late, we all knew we were capable of this type of stuff.


Anything but a sweep this weekend and I'll be happy, last week was a sign they are coming out of the Marlins funk that surrounded them for so long.

We should take two out of three this weekend, then it looks like we have turned the tables on them. We essentially knocked them out of the race last week with our sweep, oh that felt so good.

[JRoll]

Prior has 13 K's through 6 innings against the Reds today. Thank god for MLB Extra Innings, LOL.

[JRoll]

16 through 7 2/3

[PhilaVa]

You have MLB Extra Innings at school? Wtf?

Too bad the Cubs couldn't take advantage of that great performance, what a pathetic team, I really wanted to see them in the playoffs too..

[JRoll]

Well im at school at home, LOL. I commute to school so I'm at home.

[Red]

You have MLB Extra Innings at school? Wtf?

Too bad the Cubs couldn't take advantage of that great performance, what a pathetic team, I really wanted to see them in the playoffs too..
Me too. Bases loaded, at home, bottom of 11th. Excitement. The dude wiffs three pitches

[PhilaVa]

Me too. Bases loaded, at home, bottom of 11th. Excitement. The dude wiffs three pitches

And they lose the game, one game back of the Astros with three games to go with the Braves, you can all but put a fork in them with the way they are playing, very dissapointing. Guess I'll have to just root for Schill and the Sox, how Pedro gets his shit together though.

[PhilaVa]

We OWN the Marlins...nice game once again by JRoll and a big shoutout goes to the bullpen for a great job after Floyd left, I beleive only 2 hits.

[JRoll]

JRoll is a beast, tied for the league lead in triples now. The scary thing is, he can get better.

[PhilaVa]

JRoll is a beast, tied for the league lead in triples now. The scary thing is, he can get better.

I am actually excited to watch the rest of these games b/c I love to watch him at the plate, he has gone from an automatic out to someone who we all think will come through everytime. Him and Abreu, I could watch all day long.

[JRoll]

I am actually excited to watch the rest of these games b/c I love to watch him at the plate, he has gone from an automatic out to someone who we all think will come through everytime. Him and Abreu, I could watch all day long.
Let's clone Abreu, JRoll, and Thome and put a Thome clone at 3rd, a JRoll clone at 2nd, have the Abreu's patrol the outfield and put a JRoll clone at catcher. Then our hitting should be fine. We could put up with the Thome strikeouts then.

[PhilaVa]

Let's clone Abreu, JRoll, and Thome and put a Thome clone at 3rd, a JRoll clone at 2nd, have the Abreu's patrol the outfield and put a JRoll clone at catcher. Then our hitting should be fine. We could put up with the Thome strikeouts then.

The Thomes would be batting 7th and 8th...LoL..

[JRoll]

The Thomes would be batting 7th and 8th...LoL..
The perfect team

Batting order
1. JRoll
2. JRoll
3. Abreu
4. Abreu
5. Thome
6. Abreu
7. JRoll
8. Thome

Bench
Tomas
Polanco
Tank
Burrell
J-Mic

Starting Rotation
Floyd
Madson
Madson
Wolf
Padilla

Bullpen
Myers
Lidle
Madson
Wagner
F-Rod
Worrell
Telly

[PhilaVa]

Sorry, Thome in the 5th hole would kill us...LoL..

[thomeismyhomie]

3 games in a row, the team shows it has a pair and comes back. That was a great win tonight cause Willis was in command for most of the game. If nothing else, at least we'll have some confidence when we play Florida next season. Maybe we can keep this going and toss the monkey over on to their backs again.

[PhilaVa]

3 games in a row, the team shows it has a pair and comes back. That was a great win tonight cause Willis was in command for most of the game. If nothing else, at least we'll have some confidence when we play Florida next season. Maybe we can keep this going and toss the monkey over on to their backs again.

This win puts us in at least a tie for second at the end of the year, one more win and we have it to ourselves, truely dissapointing but at least it is something.

[thomeismyhomie]

Sure, I'm disappointed but this is all looking very good for next year. Ahhhh....you know its a sigh of relief to be able to be optimistic and not get bashed for it all the time.

[JRoll]

You know if the Phils win 2 of the next 3, they have played Bowaball to perfection, LOL. 86-76.

[thomeismyhomie]

That's awesome that the Rollins vs. Furcal thread is still alive! There is no doubt any more thats for sure. JRoll, your boy is "da man". What a turnaround he has had this year. God, if only he could keep this up and spare us the drama next season.

[thomeismyhomie]

well, if we keep Bowa around, at least we know what our record will be. You know, you'd think after a whole 162 game season there would be SOME difference. How do teams play so many games and end up tied at the end of the year? It's great though.

[JRoll]

That's awesome that the Rollins vs. Furcal thread is still alive! There is no doubt any more thats for sure. JRoll, your boy is "da man". What a turnaround he has had this year. God, if only he could keep this up and spare us the drama next season.
I think he's going to be even better next season. You have to figure a new hitting coach can only help him, especially if its Manuel. You see what he did with Byrd this year and the difference it made in him. It'll be nice to have a hitting coach that actually does something for once. I predict that JRoll will have over 200 hits next year with 7 HR's, an OBP of over .360 and steal 40 bases and an average around .300

[thomeismyhomie]

I agree, but I see more than 7 hrs definitely. As he has been getting more and more comfortable, you can see his approach at the plate changing. He is learning when to take big cuts and he is also finding out it isnt that difficult to pelt that wall in right field. I am really proud of him this year. Like I said, you can see a total confidence change in him when he's at the plate. If he keeps this up, that kid is going to be great.

[JRoll]

well, if we keep Bowa around, at least we know what our record will be. You know, you'd think after a whole 162 game season there would be SOME difference. How do teams play so many games and end up tied at the end of the year? It's great though.
I just think it's scary that in Bowa's tenure we would have records of 86-76, 86-76, 80-81, and 86-76, if we win 2 of the next 3

[JRoll]

I agree, but I see more than 7 hrs definitely. As he has been getting more and more comfortable, you can see his approach at the plate changing. He is learning when to take big cuts and he is also finding out it isnt that difficult to pelt that wall in right field. I am really proud of him this year. Like I said, you can see a total confidence change in him when he's at the plate. If he keeps this up, that kid is going to be great.
Between him and Utley, we got a duo that's better than Pierre and Castillo next year.

[thomeismyhomie]

It's even scarier to think about how much our team has changed during his tenure. How could this team not do better than the others? And how in the hell do you win the same amount of games? Its not like theres only 5 or 10 games or even 16 like the NFL.

[thomeismyhomie]

Man, I'm pumped for next year already with all that talk! How long till pitchers and catchers are due???....lol

[JRoll]

Man, I'm pumped for next year already with all that talk! How long till pitchers and catchers are due???....lol
my guess is between 150 and 160 days, LOL. BTW, I'm goin down to ST this coming March, hopefully I can get JRoll's autograph, I already have Madson and Floyd.

[thomeismyhomie]

Can I hear the stories? :-) Just kidding, I have a good memory. That's cool as hell though. I'm too damn far away all the way up north here. Every summer all us guys go on our b-ball trip(I think I told you guys about Toronto this year) but our next stop is Philly. I would love to go there more than anything.

[JRoll]

Way to represent for the Phils board, you get some rep for that.

[thomeismyhomie]

Thanks man, it's good to get around you guys again. I was getting frustrated with the other board. By the way, that is a badass pic of Dawkins on your signature. I love that guy.

[JRoll]

Thanks man, it's good to get around you guys again. I was getting frustrated with the other board. By the way, that is a badass pic of Dawkins on your signature. I love that guy.
my friend was tryin to tell me that Roy is a better safety than B-Dawk and that the Pats are overrated. I asked him "so you think a team that hasnt lost in 367 days is overrated?" LOL. BTW, damn you on that score, LOL. I can't get higher than 18

[thomeismyhomie]

Dawkins is the man. He is definitely better than Roy. I am a huge Tony Parrish fan but you'd almost have to watch the Niners games to see how tough he is. He got no love for his 9 INTs last year. About the game...who knows, I got on a friggin roll. How about the one I missed was a dead straight one. it was like 0.05 or something like that.

[thomeismyhomie]

Ok, so about the rep thing real quick. I clicked on the icon and gave you a comment and had it add to your rep. Is that all you have to do? Cause your rep didnt change.

[JRoll]

Ok, so about the rep thing real quick. I clicked on the icon and gave you a comment and had it add to your rep. Is that all you have to do? Cause your rep didnt change.
you don't have much rep power so it won't change, but it adds to my rep points which i see in my user CP.

[JRoll]

Dawkins is the man. He is definitely better than Roy. I am a huge Tony Parrish fan but you'd almost have to watch the Niners games to see how tough he is. He got no love for his 9 INTs last year. About the game...who knows, I got on a friggin roll. How about the one I missed was a dead straight one. it was like 0.05 or something like that.
Parrish was huge for my fantasy team last year so I know how good he is, plus having Sunday Ticket doesn't hurt, LOL.

[JRoll]

I'm hittin the sack, got class at 11, later man.

[thomeismyhomie]

Later, practice your paper toss!

[PhilaVa]

Sure, I'm disappointed but this is all looking very good for next year. Ahhhh....you know its a sigh of relief to be able to be optimistic and not get bashed for it all the time.


Yeah, I guess it is all about finishing strong...but then again I wish they were actually playing for something.

[ryr8828]

Are they playing for Bowa's job, or is it too late?

[PhilaVa]

Are they playing for Bowa's job, or is it too late?

Oh Lord, I hate to say it but they have played to well down the stretch it has given management a reason to think about it, which is a problem.

I doubt the players are playing for him, they are just playing better b/c nothing is on the line, now only if Bowa and them could translate this type of attitude and play into the next season I wouldn't care if he was the manager, but in the past two years I haven't seen otherwise, so he must go.

[Invader Newt]

I dunno, i actually don't think much of this was Bowa's fault. I think alot of it goes back to Ed Wade. Just imagine if Floyd had been brought up instead of going to Paul Abbott, or if he had been able to get anything at all at the trade deadline. Basically he was scared to trade minor league talent until after the trade deadline, then he gave up too much talent for the little pieces he got. the only thing he was able to get that was worth what he traded was Felix Rodrioguez. LIdle was ok but he gave up three prospects for him and we were just about done by the time he made the trade, Jones was basically a bust (look how well hancock pitched for the reds, nothing flashy but he put up solid 4th or 5th starter numbers)

I don't think Bowa is a great manager by any stretch, but this season at least it wasn't his fault. I'd be inclined to give him one more shot at it. Sure this team underachieved but injuries and the front office had a lot more to do with it than Bowa and for some reason Ed Wade is not getting fired. There are also not too many options available as far a managerial choices go at the moment. If you fire anyone i'd ditch Kerrigan with the exception of what he was able to do to turn Cormier's career around he has has done nothing with this pitching staff since he's been here. See if you can get Larry Anderson out of the broadcast booth, he's not a great broadcaster but he knows pitching.

[thomeismyhomie]

Newt, I respect your opinion but I really don't agree that it's Wade's fault. I believe it was more Bowa than Wade. The calling up of Floyd was an iffy call. Wade believed that he had enough talent on the team to keep our heads above water while Abbott pitched. Well, he ended up being wrong obviously, but I dont think Floyd was the answer either at the time. As for the trades at the deadline, we got Jones for two guys who were never going to make our roster...ever. The FRod trade was Wade's best mid-season deal(not saying much) and the Lidle trade worked out well for both sides. So I just don't see that arguement anymore.

The reason I think it is more Bowa's fault is because we played so many close games, that in-game management became a huge huge factor. He failed too many times and then did not handle his emotions afterwards very well. I do respect the guy but the year really took it's toll on him.

[PhilaVa]

I dunno, i actually don't think much of this was Bowa's fault. I think alot of it goes back to Ed Wade. Just imagine if Floyd had been brought up instead of going to Paul Abbott, or if he had been able to get anything at all at the trade deadline. Basically he was scared to trade minor league talent until after the trade deadline, then he gave up too much talent for the little pieces he got. the only thing he was able to get that was worth what he traded was Felix Rodrioguez. LIdle was ok but he gave up three prospects for him and we were just about done by the time he made the trade, Jones was basically a bust (look how well hancock pitched for the reds, nothing flashy but he put up solid 4th or 5th starter numbers)

Well, in defense of Ed Wade, and I usually never do this but he deserves it...it's not his fault, he made a smart move not doing anything. And you only have to go look at the Mets to figure that out. They got the susposed best player on the market and look at who they gave up and how much it did not help.

[thomeismyhomie]

Right on...I mean they got Victor Zambrano right? They game up Kazmir for him correct? You dont think Tampa is loving that deal? That kid has pitched great for them already. I know you were referring to Benson, Phila, but the Mets did get all the praise and it blew up in their faces. I think all of us were looking for more of a spark and were reacting emotionally at Wade, but in the end, he looks to be correct.

[PhilaVa]

Right on...I mean they got Victor Zambrano right? They game up Kazmir for him correct? You dont think Tampa is loving that deal? That kid has pitched great for them already. I know you were referring to Benson, Phila, but the Mets did get all the praise and it blew up in their faces. I think all of us were looking for more of a spark and were reacting emotionally at Wade, but in the end, he looks to be correct.

The fact is...Benson isn't that good, he isn't even worth Howard, and that is saying a lot about Benson b/c Howard isn't exactly a TOP prospect.

I'm just glad the Braves didn't get him b/c the guy has talent, and that coaching staff would have turned him into a HOFer.

[Invader Newt]

See i don't agree with your assessment of Ed Wade. the past two years we have had chances to do soemthing at the trade deadline and both times he has floundered saying he didn't want to trade the future for now, well most of our future was traded away ANYWAY and it didn't bring us a championship. We have very little talent above a-ball that projects to the major leagues. We have Floyd, we have Howard and everything else is either at A-ball or spent last year on the shelf with injuries.


There were players out there for the taking to play Center field none of them made their way to citizens bank park, so the answer in centerfield was bringing Marlon Byrd up again with the same flawed mechanics that cause him to slump in his first stint here this season.

If he had even brought Lidle over before the trade deadline I might not have been so critical, but he wasted weeks and probably 3 or 4 Lidle starts AND probably gave up more for him than he should of because he was feeling pressured into making a move.

Floyd coming up sooner is debateable yes. However teams that win at least attempt to see if they can patch up holes in their lineup with their own talent, if he's the can't miss prospect that we all think he is coming up a couple of months early when we needed help would not have affected him in the least.

Last year was even worse. Ed Wade needs to grow a pair or be replaced. we were fading fast last year and while the Marlins made a lot of good moves Ed Wade sat on his Duff and brought in some veteran relievers that were nowhere near as good as he thought they were. Havn't you noticed that every year when we need some spark near the trade deadline for whatever reason all Wade seems to want to do is bring in a couple of veteran middle relievers? This year he got us F-rod and i liked that trade but regardless of what i think of Bowa as a manager all the blame cannot be placed on his shoulders. The Front office IS at least partially responsible for the mess. Wade is great in the offseason building a blueprint for a season but when it comes down to the nitty gritty of midseason trading, he loses his spine. Good Gm's on teams that are supposed to contend deal with injuries and players flopping by getting adequate replacements, Wade dealt with it by hoping everything would work out in the end, lights, mirrors and a little duct tape.

[thomeismyhomie]

Hey, I think Wade is plenty accountable, I was merely evening it up a bit. I think he received a little too much criticism. He stood his gorund and wouldn't overpay for guys like Benson and he should be commended for that. He kept Madson, Hamels, Floyd, and Utley like he wanted and we are all going to be pleased he did that in the future. Like you said, we really didnt have anything else to trade. We have no prospects outside of Howard and as Phila said, he isnt even that great. I mean, he's a good prospect but he isnt the likes of a Scott Kazmir which the Mets foolishly gave away. I definitely dont agree with Wade's moves, particularly last year, but you cant blame the guy too much. He did all he could to field a winner and they didnt come through. He knew, like most of us, that we werent going to get back in this thing. Things just werent right this year. No sense in trading your future away for nothing. Think about it, the trades he made weren't just rental players. We are going to keep FRod and Lidle, and IMO Jones as well. So there you go. If you have nothing to trade at the deadline, then you cant get anything, especially when there are teams like the Mets who are willing to blow the wad.

[PhilaVa]

Think about how stupid Utley for Benson would have been, good thing that was never on the table.

Newt - I was defending wade for the deadline, I agree on almost all other points from the past two years, but I understand why he did what he did for the deadline this year.

I hear he was close to a reliever which I felt we really needed but the A's had som injuries at that time and could not pull the deal. I wanted to move Polanco since I didn't think he would be back, but it looks like even he may return next year.

[thomeismyhomie]

By the way guys, I dont know if any of you read the same article. I believe it was on Yahoo.com a few weeks ago, but I cant find it. Anyway, in short it talked about how our wheeling and dealing with the Devil Rays is far from over. We were close to a deal at the dealine that either involved Baldelli or Crawford and we would give them Byrd+?. There supposedly is a very good chance of one of those guys being in our uni next year. IMO Crawford=Pierre, only with more upside. I think Wade will get it done. I know youre in Byrd's corner Phila, and I still have faith in him, but when you get chance at Crawford, we gotta go for that I guess. Especially if we trade for him while he's still cheap. We may still have room for a starter. But then.....well....who the hell knows what we're going to do!

[PhilaVa]

By the way guys, I dont know if any of you read the same article. I believe it was on Yahoo.com a few weeks ago, but I cant find it. Anyway, in short it talked about how our wheeling and dealing with the Devil Rays is far from over. We were close to a deal at the dealine that either involved Baldelli or Crawford and we would give them Byrd+?. There supposedly is a very good chance of one of those guys being in our uni next year. IMO Crawford=Pierre, only with more upside. I think Wade will get it done. I know youre in Byrd's corner Phila, and I still have faith in him, but when you get chance at Crawford, we gotta go for that I guess. Especially if we trade for him while he's still cheap. We may still have room for a starter. But then.....well....who the hell knows what we're going to do!

I'd like to have Baldelli over Crawford, he brings more to the game then dows Crawford. But either of them would help our team, they are both better options than Byrd...at this point. Would not be a bad move at all.

[ryr8828]

I am the King at being able to get several paragraphs of intelligent discussion out of one post, a one liner at that. Oh yeah, I am the man.

Nothing like good baseball talk, I'm going to rep every one of you when I get time.

[Invader Newt]

I'd take Craford anyday. Imagine the top of the phillies lineup....

Crawford, Rollins Abreu? that would be over 100 steals combined. and all three of them could score 100 runs

Just a little clarification on my ed Wade Criticism. I am glad he didn't go after Zambrano or Benson, they may or may not have helped but the mets overpaid for them. My main concern is that he didn't adequately fill our need for a center fielder. And he waited too long to fuinish the Lidle deal. we DID have prospects, they all went in the deadline deals we had some pretty good ones too, noen of them were up there with Kazmir but they were guys other teams were asking for.

We end up getting F-rod who i like, i think this was probably the best mid-season trade Wade has ever made, Jones who is a free agent and i dunno if the Phillies sign him again, he's getting up there and he only pitched so-so with the phillies. Lidle, also a free agent, the phillies might make a push to sign him but he is a 4th or 5th starter at best, he'll eat innings and probably post double digit wins but not much else. I liked the Lidle deal but it was too little too late and too expensive considering the timing and the fact we may not resign him.

to get jones and Lidle we gave up 5 players that were under the age of 26 and still had upside as major league prospects. 2 of them are now in the reds starting lineup and playing well. And Easy Ramirez will probably crack the reds rotation next year or at least be a reliable bullpen guy.

I'd rate his midseason trades as a D+ but they'd be a big fat F if F-rod hadn't been aquired

[PhilaVa]

I am the King at being able to get several paragraphs of intelligent discussion out of one post, a one liner at that. Oh yeah, I am the man.

Nothing like good baseball talk, I'm going to rep every one of you when I get time.

That's one thing you'll find here if I have anything to do with it...I'm trying to get some more Phils Regs to come over but they seem to be not interested.

[thomeismyhomie]

Phila...ok....I'm pretty blitzed, but the Phils regulars suck. I got so sick and tired of trying to explain every single thought that came out of my mouth, it was a joke. I felt comfortable saying what I had to say to you, JRoll(most of all) and Enforcer81. Actually WestCoastPhan came around by the end of the season as well. I was basically on my own cause those other guys just posted complete crap. I look forward to a long and eventful discussion with all the "real deals" cause 2005 is going to be one worth writing home about.

[thomeismyhomie]

There it is fellas. There's our first opening series of the year, against the D.C. Whatever the hell you want to call its. It is a refreshing feeling to know that the team already has that date circled on their calendar. you know there are quite a few guy son this roster with something to prove. I say give those guys a chance and watch them flourish. Thome, Abreu, JRoll, Utley, Floyd, Madson, Wagner, FRod, Wolf, and Padilla......they will be back and ready to claim what is rightfully theirs....the NL East Crown!

[SU Nittany Tide]

Don't get me wrong...not to take anything away from the feet he has accomplished, which is very impressive, however, his OBP is right around .415, very solid but not spectacular considering his .374 BA. He only just now broke 100 runs for the season batting leadoff....though thats not all his fault considering the terrible Mariners offense. The biggest problem I see with this is that of his 259 hits....222 (!!) are singles. Add this together with his playing on a last place team and I just have to ask what in the hell these sportscasters trying to bring him into the debate are talking about.

Just for the fun of it....compare him to a fellow right fielder named Bobby Abreu (who doesn't even get close to half the hype of Ichiro). Abreu "only" has 170 hits this season right now, but he has over twice as many extra base hits. He gets on base .426 of the time compared to Ichiro's .415. He has 15 more runs scored despite hitting in the 3rd spot as opposed to leading off (Rollins has 16 more than Ichiro). He has even stolen more bases and been thrown out less than half the time of Ichiro. So if Ichiro really gets some MVP consideration, I have to wonder if Abreu would win unanimously if he was in the AL? Seriously...which player would you rather have of those two right fielders?

[thomeismyhomie]

Don't get me wrong...not to take anything away from the feet he has accomplished, which is very impressive, however, his OBP is right around .415, very solid but not spectacular considering his .374 BA. He only just now broke 100 runs for the season batting leadoff....though thats not all his fault considering the terrible Mariners offense. The biggest problem I see with this is that of his 259 hits....222 (!!) are singles. Add this together with his playing on a last place team and I just have to ask what in the hell these sportscasters trying to bring him into the debate are talking about.

Just for the fun of it....compare him to a fellow right fielder named Bobby Abreu (who doesn't even get close to half the hype of Ichiro). Abreu "only" has 170 hits this season right now, but he has over twice as many extra base hits. He gets on base .426 of the time compared to Ichiro's .415. He has 15 more runs scored despite hitting in the 3rd spot as opposed to leading off (Rollins has 16 more than Ichiro). He has even stolen more bases and been thrown out less than half the time of Ichiro. So if Ichiro really gets some MVP consideration, I have to wonder if Abreu would win unanimously if he was in the AL? Seriously...which player would you rather have of those two right fielders?
I love Ichiro, but Bobby Abreu is our man. No way in hell Ichiro is the AL MVP. The Mariners suck way too bad, and like you pointed out, he has 220+ singles this year. I wouldn't give up Abreu for anyone. By the way, it's good to see you Enforcer81. How's it been going man?

[SU Nittany Tide]

Its going pretty good.....you're in my football pickem right? Maybe even the fantasy league....cant remember for sure.

[thomeismyhomie]

Its going pretty good.....you're in my football pickem right? Maybe even the fantasy league....cant remember for sure.
I'm in the Pick Em'. MontanawasGod...that's me. I think I'm in first, or up there somewhere. I was busting JRoll's balls last night about it cause he had a great first week and then fell off the planet. It's been a wild year already though.

[SU Nittany Tide]

Yeah I think I'm doing pretty well for my first year of against the spread.....last season I dominated everyone in the straight up league (which is pretty much the norm for me). I ended up with right around 17 more wins than anyone else over the season, and beat all of the ESPN "experts" as well. I did one of those in high school on ESPN and of around 15000 people or something like that I was in the top 100 (though one guy in my group was in the top 10). Do you play Survivor football? I'm having a little trouble deciding who to go with this week.

[thomeismyhomie]

Yeah I think I'm doing pretty well for my first year of against the spread.....last season I dominated everyone in the straight up league (which is pretty much the norm for me). I ended up with right around 17 more wins than anyone else over the season, and beat all of the ESPN "experts" as well. I did one of those in high school on ESPN and of around 15000 people or something like that I was in the top 100 (though one guy in my group was in the top 10). Do you play Survivor football? I'm having a little trouble deciding who to go with this week.
That's cool. Going against the spread is so much harder....lol. To answer your question, I usually do Survivor Football but I forgot this year. Last year I won after only one week, swear to God. I picked Denver as a winner over the Bungals and every other person in my league picked the Dolphins over the Texans. So, the other 9 were eliminated. Pretty anti-climactic, but funny.

[SU Nittany Tide]

Yeah last year pretty much everyone was gone after the first two weeks....and it ended in week 9, when the both the other guy and I went out at the same time for a tie.. Also pretty anticlimactic. This year Green Bay losing to Chicago took out quite a few people. I picked Green Bay over the Giants at Lambeau, but I dont feel real confident with that pick.

[thomeismyhomie]

Yeah last year pretty much everyone was gone after the first two weeks....and it ended in week 9, when the both the other guy and I went out at the same time for a tie.. Also pretty anticlimactic. This year Green Bay losing to Chicago took out quite a few people. I picked Green Bay over the Giants at Lambeau, but I dont feel real confident with that pick.
Hmmm...the Pack at home is never a bad move, but the Giants are pretty good. I cant stand Kurt Warner but he might light up that secondary. I dont see them beating GB in Lambeu though

[JRoll]

At least I won a game this past week in the FFL and I'm not last, LOL.

[SU Nittany Tide]

At least I won a game this past week in the FFL and I'm not last, LOL.
Thats always a plus....kind of sucks that I lost and let my little brother back into the lead.

[JRoll]

Thats always a plus....kind of sucks that I lost and let my little brother back into the lead.
Well now that I got a team that i kinda to my liking, watch out. My QB's will give me better production now because I have Collins and Delhomme. You interested in McNair?

[thomeismyhomie]

Well now that I got a team that i kinda to my liking, watch out. My QB's will give me better production now because I have Collins and Delhomme. You interested in McNair?
I have Manning. Let's just say I was "pleased" to have him last week.

[JRoll]

Enforcer, you interested in McNair?

[SU Nittany Tide]

Enforcer, you interested in McNair?
Not especially....how long is he out for? I'd be happy to take Manning off your hands though ;).

[JRoll]

Not especially....how long is he out for? I'd be happy to take Manning off your hands though ;).
Well I don't have Manning but I have Delhomme and Collins, so McNair is expendable.

[SU Nittany Tide]

Oh I thought you said you had Manning....my bad. Do you know how long Mcnair is supposed to be out? Brooks should be good enough for me for the season. I have strong RB's and pretty good WR, TE, and Defense. I'm pretty well set I think. My brothers team is a force though.....good thing I did most of the prerankings for him huh?

[SU Nittany Tide]

Guess it was the Thome homie that said he had Manning.This is Great Ichiro discussion I must say!

[JRoll]

Guess it was the Thome homie that said he had Manning.This is Great Ichiro discussion I must say!
I know isnt it, LOL. I changed the title to what the discussion is

[JRoll]

Capped off the season with a Grand Slam in the bottom of the 8th with 1 out. They won 10-4 to finish 86-76, LOL. Next season, JRoll will be a beast, even more so than this season. 14 HR's is about 10 more than I expected from him.

[PhilaVa]

Capped off the season with a Grand Slam in the bottom of the 8th with 1 out. They won 10-4 to finish 86-76, LOL. Next season, JRoll will be a beast, even more so than this season. 14 HR's is about 10 more than I expected from him.

Good point on JRoll, JRoll. I also think that JRoll will be even better next year JRoll. JRoll is the best, dont' you think JRoll? JRoll?

[thomeismyhomie]

Good point on JRoll, JRoll. I also think that JRoll will be even better next year JRoll. JRoll is the best, dont' you think JRoll? JRoll?
JRoll, didnt you say earlier today that JRoll would have 7 homers next year? He is a beast, unfortunately I couldnt watch the game today cause I just didnt want to see the season end yet. It's been a hard year on all of us.

[JRoll]

JRoll, didnt you say earlier today that JRoll would have 7 homers next year? He is a beast, unfortunately I couldnt watch the game today cause I just didnt want to see the season end yet. It's been a hard year on all of us.
Maybe he's going to have more than 7, LOL. He could very possibly get 15 next year considering he had that slump to start this season. Either way, I wouldnt trade him for any other shortstop right now.

[thomeismyhomie]

Maybe he's going to have more than 7, LOL. He could very possibly get 15 next year considering he had that slump to start this season. Either way, I wouldnt trade him for any other shortstop right now.
Nope...no way no how. By the way...why doesnt it say Hexxagon champ next to your name?

[JRoll]

Nope...no way no how. By the way...why doesnt it say Hexxagon champ next to your name?
I lost it in 6 mins last night, LOL.

[thomeismyhomie]

I lost it in 6 mins last night, LOL.
Life just ain't fair sometimes...lol. But, JRoll will top 15 homers next season and maybe they'll cut him loose and let him steal 40 bases again to go with 15 triples, and 40 doubles. 70 extra base hits....sounds right to me.

[thomeismyhomie]

We took 6 of 7 from the Marlins to officially "exorcise" the demons. Thank goodness.

[PhilaVa]

We took 6 of 7 from the Marlins to officially "exorcise" the demons. Thank goodness.

Yeah, not to mention a real kick in the balls knocking them out of the playoff race.

[JRoll]

Yeah, not to mention a real kick in the balls knocking them out of the playoff race.
Not to bring you down, but even if they would've swept all 7 games, they wouldnt have made it, Houston just played that well, LOL.

[PhilaVa]

Not to bring you down, but even if they would've swept all 7 games, they wouldnt have made it, Houston just played that well, LOL.

Dude, shutup. You're killing my high.

[thomeismyhomie]

Not to bring you down, but even if they would've swept all 7 games, they wouldnt have made it, Houston just played that well, LOL.
Houston's record was 48-26 since Garner took over. How about that shit?

[PhilaVa]

Houston's record was 48-26 since Garner took over. How about that shit?

Shhh...if TJD gets a hold of that he'll drill it to us for the entire off season.

[JRoll]

Houston's record was 48-26 since Garner took over. How about that shit?
Makes me depressed about what could've been with this team, LOL.

[PhilaVa]

Makes me depressed about what could've been with this team, LOL.

What? I think about that every time this team won a meaningless game, expecially when we took 3 of 4 from the braves a couple weeks ago, what a waste.

[thomeismyhomie]

What? I think about that every time this team won a meaningless game, expecially when we took 3 of 4 from the braves a couple weeks ago, what a waste.
I feel bad for TJD's wife. He doesnt have us to bitch to anymore so who do you think has to listen to him? JK....he was nutty but a good guy.

[Domino427]

yeah...i remember some really bitter arguments...and his bowa bashing became second nature so much that he couldn't listen to anything else....but he was a damn good guy

[thomeismyhomie]

gives his endorsement saying "this is the best group of guys he's played with". Man, what the hell do they do in that clubhouse?

[Domino427]

sounds like the guys are pretty damn good w/each other. as much as I love Bowa, maybe this is the best move.

And that's coming from FRod, who supposedly doesnt like Worrell.....so that's saying somethin

[Phillyfan11]

I was at the game today.It was a great way to end the season.Too bad that they didn't play like that all season,who knows what the outcome could have been.It was special for me b/c I'm going to be 40 in January and I been going to Phillies games since I was 5 and in the 8th inning when the bases were loaded and Rollins came up to bat,I turned to my wife and said "Wouldn't be great if Jimmy hit a grand slam and go out with a blaze of glory",and then Jimmy hitted it out,and the guy in front of said to "You called that one".Like I said before,been to alot of Phillies games,but I finally seen a grand slam homer live for the first time!Guess we'll see what will happen during the off season and hopefully 2005 will be better

[Enyalois]

I was just wondering now that the season over is he going to get surgery or did the second opinion suggest he doesn't need it?

[thomeismyhomie]

I was just wondering now that the season over is he going to get surgery or did the second opinion suggest he doesn't need it?
All I've been reading is that he said he feels great and he isn't going to get surgery. Now, he may have just been saying that so, who knows? But, it sure didn't seem like he was going to do it.

[PhilaVa]

I was just wondering now that the season over is he going to get surgery or did the second opinion suggest he doesn't need it?

Yeah, I agree with Homie, last I heard he wasnt' going to have surgery, frankly that could be a problem for us next year if this thing isn't fully healthy. I hope Pat knows what he is doing.

[thomeismyhomie]

Yeah, I agree with Homie, last I heard he wasnt' going to have surgery, frankly that could be a problem for us next year if this thing isn't fully healthy. I hope Pat knows what he is doing.
Right, and like Burrell needed any more problems.

[PhilaVa]

Right, and like Burrell needed any more problems.

Well the thing that worries me about him is he went to two doctors who told him to go get surgery and then he then went to another one who told him he didn't have too. So it almost looks like he was going to go until he heard what he want and I don't know how great it is to ignore doctors like that. What is the extent of the injury anyway?

[thomeismyhomie]

Well the thing that worries me about him is he went to two doctors who told him to go get surgery and then he then went to another one who told him he didn't have too. So it almost looks like he was going to go until he heard what he want and I don't know how great it is to ignore doctors like that. What is the extent of the injury anyway?
I don't think anyone ever said he "tore" anything in his wrist, but it needed surgery cause the ligaments weren't going to heal right. When he saw the last doctor, all he said was there wasn't any more damage he could do to it. I don't understand. You ever notice how it seems all athletes end up getting about 12 opinions until miraculously a doctor will tell them there is nothing wrong, even if the first guy said he was done. All I can think of is maybe his first opinion was from our team doctor and then he finally went to a specialist who could give him a 100% answer. I have never really understood how that seems to happen all the time though.

[PhilaVa]

I don't think anyone ever said he "tore" anything in his wrist, but it needed surgery cause the ligaments weren't going to heal right. When he saw the last doctor, all he said was there wasn't any more damage he could do to it. I don't understand. You ever notice how it seems all athletes end up getting about 12 opinions until miraculously a doctor will tell them there is nothing wrong, even if the first guy said he was done. All I can think of is maybe his first opinion was from our team doctor and then he finally went to a specialist who could give him a 100% answer. I have never really understood how that seems to happen all the time though.

Ok, so here is the question what were Burrells numbers since he came back?

[thomeismyhomie]

Ok, so here is the question what were Burrells numbers since he came back?
Man, that got lost in the winning we were doing. He was crap. I know I read the postgame after he went 4-4 the other night and it said he was batting around .200 with like 3 homers and 8 RBI's or something like that. Thats just off the top of my head though. I know his average was about .265 when he got hurt and it wound up being about .255

[thomeismyhomie]

Man, that got lost in the winning we were doing. He was crap. I know I read the postgame after he went 4-4 the other night and it said he was batting around .200 with like 3 homers and 8 RBI's or something like that. Thats just off the top of my head though. I know his average was about .265 when he got hurt and it wound up being about .255
I did a little investigation. His average was .263 when he returned at the beginning of September. By September 28th his average had dropped to .249! His four hit game jumped him back up and he ended at .257

[thomeismyhomie]

I did a little investigation. His average was .263 when he returned at the beginning of September. By September 28th his average had dropped to .249! His four hit game jumped him back up and he ended at .257
Sorry, did a little more. I was way off on the homers and RBI's. He had 5 homers and 15 RBIS the last 30 days of the year. How about Lieberthal hit .379 during that frame with an OBP of .446

[PhilaVa]

Sorry, did a little more. I was way off on the homers and RBI's. He had 5 homers and 15 RBIS the last 30 days of the year. How about Lieberthal hit .379 during that frame with an OBP of .446

Yeah, Lieby really turned it around after that horrible start, people were still on him bad even to the end, I couldn't understand it.

[thomeismyhomie]

Yeah, Lieby really turned it around after that horrible start, people were still on him bad even to the end, I couldn't understand it.
People are just bitter. I told you before about how I would get in to arguements and be telling people to stop treating your team like it's a video game where you look at the guys ratings, drop him and go pick up someone else, just cause you can. Loyalty man, thats all I want to see sometimes.

[PhilaVa]

People are just bitter. I told you before about how I would get in to arguements and be telling people to stop treating your team like it's a video game where you look at the guys ratings, drop him and go pick up someone else, just cause you can. Loyalty man, thats all I want to see sometimes.

That's why I'm glad we have these boards, even though the games are over there will be no posters who only come to complain, that was the worst thing about the E*PN Phillies Board.

[thomeismyhomie]

That's why I'm glad we have these boards, even though the games are over there will be no posters who only come to complain, that was the worst thing about the E*PN Phillies Board.
I lasted about 2 weeks on the 49ers board over there before I finally got so sick of the morons that I said to hell with it. It is dumbfounding how many idiots walk the face of the earth and all manage to convene to one area.

[PhilaVa]

I lasted about 2 weeks on the 49ers board over there before I finally got so sick of the morons that I said to hell with it. It is dumbfounding how many idiots walk the face of the earth and all manage to convene to one area.

Is there no Niners board here?

[thomeismyhomie]

Is there no Niners board here?
There is one, but noone is on there. Go figure now...lol. I told the guys I was watching the game with last night that the next time I go out to watch the game, I'm going to be one of those "bagheads"

[thomeismyhomie]

I have been watching the HBO special about the Red Sox and the Buckner incident. Good God....I feel for these people.

[PhilaVa]

I have been watching the HBO special about the Red Sox and the Buckner incident. Good God....I feel for these people.

Well at least they go to the Playoffs, that's all I ask for, just get to the bloody playoffs, PLEASE.

[thomeismyhomie]

I have been watching the HBO special about the Red Sox and the Buckner incident. Good God....I feel for these people.
I'll keep it to one thread Phila. I'm headed off to work so I'll catch up with you guys later tonight. Oh God....I just realized...what the hell am I going to do there? There's no more baseball to watch.

[PhilaVa]

I'll keep it to one thread Phila. I'm headed off to work so I'll catch up with you guys later tonight. Oh God....I just realized...what the hell am I going to do there? There's no more baseball to watch.

There is nothing wrong with this, it's about baseball and connects to Phillies, it's not that strict, I'll correct it if it's out of hand, don't worry about it at all.

[FreezeC2]

Say you're caught drunk driving while still under probation, the judge sentences to X amount of prison time.

What's the chances of you telling the judge "Listen, I got some really important stuff to do at work, it may last a couple weeks. Can I go to jail after that?" and the judge going ok?

Now what are the chances if you're a professional athlete who's arrested in the area of the team he plays for?


Lucky for Furcal he wasn't DUI on a road trip.

[manny]

Cobb County has a work release program that according to his lawyer is really good. They will work with people if they have special circumstances like a student that needs to finish a semester etc. He is under house arrest now until he reports to jail. The judge stated, the only reason he is allowing it, is because of the house arrest and 24 hour monitoring.

[Iowa_Card]

Cobb County has a work release program that according to his lawyer is really good. They will work with people if they have special circumstances like a student that needs to finish a semester etc. He is under house arrest now until he reports to jail. The judge stated, the only reason he is allowing it, is because of the house arrest and 24 hour monitoring.
So does Furcal have to wear the ankle bracelet out on the field? :D

People get released from jail on work-release programs all the time if the crime is a misdemenour(sp). If it's a felony, you usually have to post bail to get out of jail.

[Fan]

Say you're caught drunk driving while still under probation, the judge sentences to X amount of prison time.

What's the chances of you telling the judge "Listen, I got some really important stuff to do at work, it may last a couple weeks. Can I go to jail after that?" and the judge going ok?

Now what are the chances if you're a professional athlete who's arrested in the area of the team he plays for?


Lucky for Furcal he wasn't DUI on a road trip.
Starting times for sentences are usually discretionary for most courts ...


And often they take into consideration work and family issues.

Depends on the Judge.

I have NO idea about this situation or jurisdiction ... but it doesn't sound unusual at all.

[asheylarry]

I don't see too many regular folks getting this kind of treatment. Especially when you look at the fact that this is his second DUI conviction and it comes before he is even off probation for his first DUI.

[thomeismyhomie]

I'll go one better. Say you're out and about at the bars and you get smashed. You then decide to drive home. While driving home you get in to a huge accident killing a woman. You somehow escape any serious hard time and basically get a slap on the wrist. While being on probation for the rest of your natural life, you decide, "oh well, it doesnt really effect me." So you go out to the bar again and get blasted. On your way home, THANKFULLY the cops arrest you before you end up killing someone again.
Judge: "Well, Mr. Leonard Little, how nice of you to drop in again."
Little: "Sir, I'm a football player."
Judge: "oh, well I'll just have to put you on super secret probation then."

It made me fucking ill to see that piece of crap out there on the football field last Sunday night.

[Iowa_Card]

I think it's the judge's discretion whether to give Furcal work-release or not.

Even if he didn't have the 24-hour monitoring device, I highly doubt that he'd flee to avoid prosecution. I bet he won't even have his probation revoked for this incident as I believe it's up to the judge who gave him probation the first time to decide if he wants to revoke it.

[Iowa_Card]

I'll go one better. Say you're out and about at the bars and you get smashed. You then decide to drive home. While driving home you get in to a huge accident killing a woman. You somehow escape any serious hard time and basically get a slap on the wrist. While being on probation for the rest of your natural life, you decide, "oh well, it doesnt really effect me." So you go out to the bar again and get blasted. On your way home, THANKFULLY the cops arrest you before you end up killing someone again.
Judge: "Well, Mr. Leonard Little, how nice of you to drop in again."
Little: "Sir, I'm a football player."
Judge: "oh, well I'll just have to put you on super secret probation then."

It made me fucking ill to see that piece of crap out there on the football field last Sunday night.
While I agree with you about Little, to my knowledge Furcal didn't kill anyone the first or second time he was pulled over for DUI. The situation you explained doesn't relate to the one Furcal is in right now. What is being allowed for Furcal happens quite a bit for anyone as long as their record is clean. In other words, if you don't have a history with the law, judges usually cut you some slack. Being a decent citizen does have it's advantages every once in awhile.

[DaveBrownisgod]

I don't see too many regular folks getting this kind of treatment. Especially when you look at the fact that this is his second DUI conviction and it comes before he is even off probation for his first DUI.
This goes right along with Jamal Lewis getting to wait until the end of the season to serve a 4 month jail sentence and the judge in Colorado working around Bryant's NBA schedule for him to have his rape trial. If either one would have been one of us we would have been in jail immediately and in Bryant's case, if we could have posted bail, we wouldn't be able to leave the state, it's amazing what notoriety and money can do for you.

[thomeismyhomie]

While I agree with you about Little, to my knowledge Furcal didn't kill anyone the first or second time he was pulled over for DUI. The situation you explained doesn't relate to the one Furcal is in right now. What is being allowed for Furcal happens quite a bit for anyone as long as their record is clean. In other words, if you don't have a history with the law, judges usually cut you some slack. Being a decent citizen does have it's advantages every once in awhile.
No, I know. I was merely venting about it. In a way, it was to defend Furcal a little bit. I mean, I dont condone what he did, but I was simply making the point of 'look how these guys get treated'. Little's case is much more messed up than Furcals.

[Iowa_Card]

No, I know. I was merely venting about it. In a way, it was to defend Furcal a little bit. I mean, I dont condone what he did, but I was simply making the point of 'look how these guys get treated'. Little's case is much more messed up than Furcals.
Oh, I see now. Thanks for the clarification.

[Iowa_Card]

This goes right along with Jamal Lewis getting to wait until the end of the season to serve a 4 month jail sentence and the judge in Colorado working around Bryant's NBA schedule for him to have his rape trial. If either one would have been one of us we would have been in jail immediately and in Bryant's case, if we could have posted bail, we wouldn't be able to leave the state, it's amazing what notoriety and money can do for you.
1) Lewis's plea bargain may have included the stipulation that he serve the sentence after the season was up. Do I like it? Absolutely not, but unlike my job their's only lasts for a short period of time. The conviction is added to his record the same whether he serves it now or in 4 months. If they did that for me, I wouldn't go to jail at all unless my employer decided to fire me because I don't have an extended period of time where I'm not at work (unless I take vacation). I had a friend who was sentenced to jailtime. He went to work Monday - Friday. He stayed in a jail cell when he wasn't at work.

2) Kobe never went to trial because the DA dropped the charges. He was required to be at some pre-trial hearings that went on during the season.

[manny]

I don't see too many regular folks getting this kind of treatment. Especially when you look at the fact that this is his second DUI conviction and it comes before he is even off probation for his first DUI.

This is where you are wrong, this is the first one that he is going to jail for, and it is not out of the ordinary for Cobb County to do this. His lawyer was working on it at 5 AM while Furcal was being arrested when the Atlanta Police Dept called him to let him know.

[manny]

I think it's the judge's discretion whether to give Furcal work-release or not.

Even if he didn't have the 24-hour monitoring device, I highly doubt that he'd flee to avoid prosecution. I bet he won't even have his probation revoked for this incident as I believe it's up to the judge who gave him probation the first time to decide if he wants to revoke it.

What he is facing now, is for the first one. He had 49 days left on his probation, and the sentence is 21 days in jail and 28 days in rehab.

[Iowa_Card]

What he is facing now, is for the first one. He had 49 days left on his probation, and the sentence is 21 days in jail and 28 days in rehab.
What was the first probation for?

[manny]

The first DUI, where he tried to cross a concrete divider and busted his oil pan. The second DUI has only had an initial hearing if memory serves me correctly.